The just-concluded confirmation of charges hearings against six Kenyans at the International Criminal Court are having an increasing impact in Kenya ahead of presidential elections in 2012. The six face charges over crimes committed during the post-election violence in Kenya in 2008.
By Judie Kaberia, Nairobi
International Centre for Transitional Justice acting Head of Office Christine Alai says whether the ICC confirms the charges against the Ocampo 6 or not, Kenyans are already feeling the political consequences.
Since two of the suspects, Deputy Prime Minister Uhuru Kenyatta and MP William Ruto are presidential candidates Alai is certain that the political atmosphere will be highly charged by the court’s decision.
“Whether there are trials or not, we are likely to be faced with a political situation. What does it mean for the supporters, what does it mean for Uhuru and Ruto - can they still vie?” she queries.
Vote of sympathy
Ruto and Kenyatta have used their cases to evoke sympathy as they crisscross the country wooing people to vote for them. The two belong to the G7 Alliance. Ruto is expected to be Kenyatta’s running mate.
Alai says there are fears of harassment of witnesses and victims following the information released during the confirmation of charges hearings. “It is because of this political situation that we have been witnessing intimidations, even though the ICC process is guided by the law. The fact is, we live in a political context, whether the cases are confirmed or not,” she asserts.
Lordrick Mayabi who has been closely following the proceedings believes some of the cases are likely to move to trial. “I can see some charges being confirmed. Both the defence and prosecution agree that the crimes were committed. So someone has to be charged. Also I have not seen the defence lawyers distance their clients from the charges.”
New breed
Fredrick Mutie, who relocated to Nairobi from Nakuru after the post-election violence actually wants the Ocampo 6 to be jailed. “Let them stay there, we wish they can all go and disappear then we get a new breed of politicians who care about us!” he says.
For Lilian Atieno, who lives in Nairobi, Ocampo did not have proper evidence. “Ocampo’s evidence was not as concrete as I expected. Bbut you can never tell, maybe he has much more in store.”
Another Kenyan who does not want to be named summarises the proceedings as ‘total confusion’.
“All that is happening at The Hague is confusion and I wish that the truth would come out so that our people can come back,” he says.
No stress
However some Kenyans are not bothered by what is happening. All they want is for the legal process to take its course and then wait for the final decision.
“These suspects are giving us stress. I escaped teargas in 2008 and I don’t want more stress now. Let the ICC do its work,” says Andrew Mwendwa.
Alai is advising Kenyans to stay calm and not to get caught up in activities likely to affect national peace.
“I would urge Kenyans to wait for the decision of the judges. We should not rush in making any conclusions on the outcome based on what the prosecution or defence said,” she cautions.
Ruto, MP Henry Kosgey and Radio Personality Joshua arap Sang will know if their case will proceed to trials on 24th December - while Head of Civil Service Ambassador Francis Muthaura, Postmaster General Hussein Ali and Uhuru Kenyatta will know their fate on Jan 16.
ICC Spokesman Fadi el Abdallah said that based on the evidence presented the three pre-trial judges can either confirm or reject some or all of the charges.
The judges can also request the prosecutor to amend his evidence or carry out further investigations.
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I think this great men,s deserve to go to hangue cos thy
Anything we say now is not going to be used to persued jugement at the ICC. Already they clossed hearing-- let us be patient and wait for the ruling. stop politicising about the legibility/illegibity of the case.
Anything we say now will not change the decision- ICC court is yet to decide.They heard already what they needed,let us be patient and wait for the rulling.
it was encouraging to see how the high and the might were reduced.it should be a lesson for the future that at no time will it ever be fashionable to use hatred as a campaign tool.unity based on hate and alienation of a section of Kenyans will collapse sooner than later.lets love one another.Kenya is for us all.
it was encouraging to see how the high and the might were reduced.it should be a lesson for the future that at no time will it ever be fashionable to use hatred as a campaign tool.unity based on hate and alienation of a section of Kenyans will collapse sooner than later.lets love one another.Kenya is for us all.
Here here...
Just watched a news story taking place in the bush, and observed members of a community(youth and elders) speaking to the press about their grievances. What was very interesting to observe is that while the interview was on, these youth and elders were using their phone to record the conversation.
You are not going to accuse them of anything they did not say... Individual vigilance is ON!!
I do respect all the views of fellows Kenyans,but one that im not certain, is that,if Ocampo has no 100% evidence againast the culprit,then why should we bother? if he has evidence enough,then why dont we wait and see!I see we kenyans rare rather impatient.according to my view,we wait n see!!!
I sympathize with your view, however, let us empathize with the fact that Kenya has had a crime committed against it and this crime was not the result of actions by a few(6). It has been a buildup of injustices to a society by those bearing the authority of the Republic and the representatives of the people of Kenya. Therefore, to get to the truth of any complex situation, proper investigation and understanding of what has happened must be pursued. Don't you think?
The current case before the Judges only seeks to ascertain whether or not the prosecutor really has sufficient evidence that would prove either involvement or culpability by the 6, in organizing events that led to PEV in Kenya.
If the case is found to be insufficient to show either involvement or culpability by the 6, then the OTP will have failed to have done proper investigations. This is true whether the 6 are really innocent of any organizing that led directly to PEV, or Not!
If the case is found to be sufficient to show either involvement or culpability by the 6, then the OTP will have either carried out proper investigations or simply stumbled on evidence that is sufficient enough to press charges(Remember, even with this outcome, it still, may not prove enough to find guilty).
Also, the outcomes could also determine that there maybe a case to answer, But, not in the court of the ICC(Jurisdiction) and not for the charges brought by the OTP.
In either case outcome, the Judges need the OTP to have carried out proper investigations to determine the Truth, Not just some Suspects!
Kenyans are worried that this case may be a sham because;
1. We don't know whether the 6 names were really/all from the Waki 10 list,
2. We don't know whether there are others who were involved but for whatever reason, they were not found out.
3. We don't know whether there were real investigations were carried out by the OTP.
4. And more importantly, there is no absolute mention of who and what organized(s) persons were used! The 'Network' in one case is speculative and unsubstantiated, while the idea that the GOK worked with the Police, KANU and Mungiki is also speculative, far fetched and unsubstantiated.
We just want the truth! What the OTP has presented is just a 'Maybe' and a fishing expedition! The OTP has failed to find the truth in a Friendly, Peaceful, Cooperative and Hopeful Country and this hurts! Politics and biases aside!
What we have here is two men each claiming a baby is theirs... and Judges being asked to determine who the real father is, without the mother or blood work or DNA being availed! The outcome is clear....AN ORDER TO INVESTIGATE further!!
I do respect all the views of fellows Kenyans,but one that im not certain, is that,if Ocampo has no 100% evidence againast the culprit,then why should we bother? if he has evidence enough,then why dont we wait and see!I see we kenyans rare rather impatient.according to my view,we wait n see!!!
In the interest of Justice ad Truth I will hypothesize what the investigations should focus on!
1. Was there any planning for post election Violence?
Many Kenyans are very aware that indeed there was talk of what should happen should ODM loose! There was coordinated campaigning including ethnic-cleansing propaganda, Historical injustices propaganda, wealth inequality propaganda, distribution of money/handouts and hard-line youth organizing. Just ask the right questions to the right people and one will find persons responsible at grass-root level and it would be easy to track upwards to the king-pins. This would lead to real evidence/witnesses, time-lines and organization ... if any!
2. Were the elections rigged and/or stolen?
There is paper trail evidence of what type of rigging took place and where! The question here is what the political parties orchestrated to secure their election. This would show culpability in motive and organization ... if any!
3. How did the PEV unfold (time-lines, areas affected and victims)?
To show motive and crime!
4. What were the various party campaign co-ordination teams doing pre and post PEV?
This will show control of organization, culpability and real suspects... if any!
5. What was the government machinery doing?
Remember the government, prior to the elections, consisted of both ODM and PNU personalities, with only KANU in Opposition and out of Government (KANU lost in 2002 and were in Orange camp in 2005, therefore only making it back into government in 2008). This will demonstrate motive, negligence and organization...if any!
6. What does the Money say?
Follow the money! Every political party invested large amounts of money that is accounted for.
7. What do the Telephone records say?
It is possible to track who called whom and when in that one month period. Especially for the political party campaign teams.
If anyone bothered to answer ALL these questions it would become clear who is responsible.........
8.
And in the interest of Reconciliation and Peace we should seek to understand and answer the following questions.
1. Why did the people of Kenya fight each other?
What were the driving forces and underlying causes for the violence.
2. What has been done to address the above causes?
By government and the people.
3. What is being done to forgive and reconcile the people?
4. What is being done to stop bad politics?
The genesis of all the PEV sincerely speaking was caused by the incubent government of that day who have/are always triving on impunity and want to continue pertuating corruption and dictatorial tendancies/leaderships.These undemocratic kenyans did not want to recognise the voters democratic outcome rights which was obvious to all and sundry for a change of government.They employed all manner of power at their disposal in conjuction with the then ECK and obviously tempered with the outcome of that election to their fullest selfish advantage.
I support this.The Occampo six should not mix 2012 election with this crime they commited.More so Mr. Odinga has nothung to do with this PEV.
TOKebabe.
I was a victim of PEV. All those responsible must face justice. Even if it threatens the unity of our nation, Justice must be seen to be done.
The only real lesson for me and i hope y'all is IT DOESN'T MATTER WHETHER YOU ARE A LEADER OR WANJIKU - IT IS OUR INDIVIDUAL RESPONSIBILITY TO ACT RIGHT!!!
Watching the Hague I was intrigued by the skimpy, alleged evidence Ocampo and team displayed! I was disappointed and shocked that hearsay was even entertained in the court. I was also disappointed with the lack of understanding of the Kenyan situation and disgusted when ordinary Kenyans were made to look backward on one hand and sophisticated on the other...
But why was the time line of PEV events not illustrated and tied to the cases. Know I want to know who the other 4 suspects are......
But there is an even more alarming trend I note: Why is it that no one knows what happened?? Really!! Are we to believe that the violence did not have participants?? If there are Kenyans out there who in one way or another participated, why have they not come out?? Do they really want reconciliation and the truth to come out or are they still hoping for more money/reasons/permission or pretense to repeat what happened??
We know that the PEV occurred in all the strong holds of ODM(esp the Pentagon strong-holds), we also know that Nakuru, Naivasha and parts of Limuru-Narobi areas experienced retaliation and civil defense(ALL in line with our mob justice mentality). If you are not sure just read the Waki report! We also know that some politicians had very irresponsible utterances and that the government machinery was slow and ill equipped to act better in response!! What we don't know and cannot speculate on is who, if anyone, organized any Violence, and this is what the ICC prosecution investigations was supposed to prove!!!
Has anyone asked themselves why none of the current group of politicians have any knowledge of any organization towards the PEV?? Are we to believe that none of them know anything?? Or that those 6 suspect are the only ones with machinery that no one else knows about?? Oh yes, am I and you also to believe that the police have nothing else to add in terms of intelligence and further investigations??
Before we attack each other citing justice and all that, THINK A LITTLE ABOUT WHERE THE TRUTH IS SUPPOSED TO COME FROM!!! Then ask yourself why it has not ...whether people have not come forth...whether Ocampo did not investigate...whether All local investigating arms did not get enough to prove Any case against Anyone!! Who are they all Protecting.
kudos to ocampo and the icc, kenyans should realise that we have been taken captives by this politician who preach water as they take wine.we should not sympathise with them at all.let justice takes its own course
kudos to ocampo and the icc, kenyans should realise that we have been taken captives by this politician who preach water as they take wine.we should not sympathise with at all.let justice takes its own course
ocampo is more all less an audience seeker, he never investigated anybody, all his evidence is all copy and paste business, as for me he only come to Kenya for holiday and show off, no wonder the adaptation of the cheater at the animal orphanage
. The crimes were committed but the guy cannot proof a thing. Who could have imagined Uhuru Kenyatta pining him down, after 45mts ocampo literally had nothing to say
why not you speak like Murithi Samuel (the tribal follower of mr. uhuru).
1. what do you know/understand about "evidenc"?
2. do you know any chapter of your new constitution that surpport your rights?
3. how do you know that ocampo is having only copy and paste of evidence?
LAWYER REPRESENTING THE VICTIMS IN ICC CASE MR. ANYA IS IN TOWN.LET ME REMID YOU THAT YOU CAME IN KENYA TO INTARROGATE THE VICTIMS NOT TO MEET MIGUNAMIGUNA
Its a pitty when someone thinks that Raila fixed anything about Uhuru and Ruto. When they were rallied to have a local tribunal they chose the hague way. When taken to hague, its Raila takin them there. Can someone tell me who gave Ocampo the names is it not Koffi Annan and Judge Philip Waki. Think of it as a crime against humanity other than someone fixing others.
koffi Annan did not give the names because i remember his envelop contained 10 names. if he did so, where are the oher 4 culprits
I really get pissed off by my fellow Kenyans. I don't know what is wrong with us. Either we have very short memories or we are just stupid. Why do we worship these politicians who don't do anything for us. I was so disgusted at the way Kenyans stormed the airport when these crooks arrived from the Hague. They are not heros!!!! These are people who have stolen from the nation, killed, lied and yet we go and welcome them like they have just won the world cup. SIGH!!!!!
We all know Kenyans lost their lives in 2007/8 and we all know why. The mere fact these these people are still holding public offices is beyond me. I cringe each time I see these fellows on TV lying through their teeth and looking for sympathy votes. COME ON KENYANS WHEN WILL YOU WAKE UP AND SEE THESE CROOKS FOR WHO THEY REALLY ARE!!!! I am so DISGUSTED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Mr. Ocampo we wish you well and we are praying for you. Do your job and do it well. Remove these crooks from our lives.
everyone is innocent until proven guilty. just cut all that crap. if the suspects are jailed or not we will still be poor kenyans . dont give youselfs the role of judges. NNNNNNKKKKKKKKTTTTTTT!!!!!!!!!!!
1. mr. rutto, mr. Uhuru. if you are men enough, why are you afraid of Mr. Aguambo?
2. if Aguambo decide not to vie for the top seat, whose name will you be using to adress your audience in you campains?
3. ruto. we want leaders who are ready to care for our environmet like the late-mama. not leaders who stops wanainchi from planting trees at mau.
4. mr. uhuru, how many times have you had computer error in your office?
5. who took an action againist you about it, mr. kenytta?
IT REALLY MATTER. UNLESS SOMEONE IS HOLD RESPONSIBLE VICTIMS WILL NEVER REST. IF IN ANY WAY OCAMPK FAILS. WE WILL ALL DIE. THESE CROOKS WILL TAKE IT AS ROUTINE. COMMITING CRIMES N GO FREE. FOR A DISERTISFIED SOUL, NO PEACE. THESE R NOT HEROS, THEY R MURDEROUS. THEY CAN TRY TO WOO US BUT THEY SHOULD KBOW THAT OUR INNOCENT BLNOD IS CRYING SOO BITTERLY.
I LIKE THE REACTION. BUT ONE QUESTION TO ASK, WHAT IS JUSTICE? YES THE VICTIMS NEED JUSTICE BUT NOT AT THE EXPENSE OF INNOCENT KENYA'S. OCAMPO CLAIMS HE HAS NO EVIDENCE AGAINST KIBAKI,YET HIS EVIDENCE AGAINST CASE 2 IS THAT MUNGIKI HELD MEETINGS IN THE STATE HOUSE, WHO RESIDES IN STATE HOUSE? IS IT NOT KIBAKI? HOW MANY CASES HAVE NOT BEEN CONFIRMED IN ICC? DO YOU NOW WHY? BECAUSE THEY WERE INFLUENCED POLITICALLY. KOFFI ANNAN WENT WITH AN ENVELOP CONTAINING 10 NAMES YET OCAMPO HAS 6 WHY? DID OCAMPO RELIED ON OTHER REPORTS INSTEAD OF CARRYING OUT HIS OWN INVESTIGATIONS. HE CONCENTRATED MOSTLY IN CENTRAL AND RIFT VALLEY PROVINCE, WHY NOT OTHER PROVINCES? OCAMPO'S EVIDENCE IS INCOMPLETE. I THINK HE WILL BE TOLD TO START FRESH INVESTIGATIONS. ANNAN HAS SAID " ICC NOW NEEDS A BETTER PERSON QUALIFIED FOR THE JOB " THINK KEENLY ABOUT THE STATEMENT. KENYAN'S SHOULD REMAIN CALM AS JUDGES PERFORM THEIR DUTY. NICE TIME FELLOW KENYAS
To me guys stop crying loud for nothing.I smell some hatred in your comments. Tell me in Kisumu there was violence but it's police who shot at civilians. How many people were shot in Kisumu do you know? So let's wait for justice as much as I can remember, nobody is guilty until proved guilty. Some comments here are partial addressed and this is taking our country no where. Try and create peace so that we may all leave in a peaceful enviroment. Remember the bible, we are all created in the image of God and that's why respect life.
Were the civilians shots while in their houses? These were thugs looting other people's property,so pliz think twice b4 u comment anything
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